Justus For All

None Sine Causa

Obama’s Foreign Policy

10:22 am on Friday, May 4, 2007

Honest Partisan recommended this speech: Foreign Policy Remarks at CCGA  by Barack Obama to me and asked for my comments on it.  Overall, it strikes me like a lot of Obama’s speeches as being very heavy with ideas and sentiments that I agree with, or at least support, but light on any actual concrete proposals.  Where there are proposals, there is typically little that explains how they will come to pass.

This is of course not a trait that is unique to Obama amoung politicians.  For some reason though it seems more prevelant to me in his speeches then in others.  Perhaps it is simply because the rhetoric is so good, or perhaps it is because due to his reletively small amount of political experience I scruntinize what he says closer then I do with others, but in any event Obama seldom seems to put out anything that is very ’solid’ in my opinion.

There are however a few solid propossals in this speech, I will try to pick them out and address them individually.

The first is a phased withdrawal of most combat forces from Iraq by March 18, 2008.  I don’t think that anyone is surprised that I disagree with this idea.  Obama’s reasoning for it seems to be that this will increase the speed of political resolution between Iraq’s feuding factions, make Hamas,Hezbollah and Iran feel less secure, and enable us to do more in Afghanistan.  Of those reasons I think that the first is plausible, although not assured and certainly it seems likely that while a resolution may be ‘faster’ it may not be ‘better’ then what would occur if we stayed longer.  The second reason seems plainly stupid to me, while it could be argued that by exposing the limits of our power in Iraq we have emboldened those groups (and I would say we exposed the limits of our will more then our power) it hardly follows that retreat now would make these entities less bold.  Indeed the opposite seems true to me.  As for Afghanistan, while more could possibly be done their, I would imagine that if jihadist elements succeed in driving our forces from Iraq, the efforts of that sort of group in Afghanistan would increase, rather then decrease.  If we can’t defeat an ‘insurgency’ in Iraq, how can we do it in Afghanistan?

Obama’s next concrete proposal is adding 65,000 soldiers to the Army and 27,000 Marines.  I don’t have any particular problem with this, and am inclined to believe that we need to increase the manpower of our armed forces, although as I have said in the past I think that what we really need is another branch dedicated specifically to ‘nation building.’

Obama next addresses proliferation and securing lose nukes and WMD components.   The one serious, concrete idea he put forth here is support for an international nuclear fuel bank.  This seems to me like a good idea, and I have no issues with it.  The rest of this section is fairly generic ‘do more’ and ‘cooperate with other nations’ stuff.  Fine and dandy, but nothing serious.  He also mentioned that part of the problem is America’s nuclear arsenal, the state of readiness that it is in and that we shouldn’t develop a new generation of nuclear weapons.  While I think that there are a number of reasons one could put forth against all of these things, nuclear proliferation is not one of them.  The utility of a nuclear weapon is partially determined by how scarce they are.  If I have the only bomb in the world, I am much more powerful then if I have one bomb out of thousands.  Us having less weapons, or choosing not to develop new ones, will not make nuclear weapons less desirable for tyrants and terrorists.

Next Obama goes into international institutions.  Most of this section is simply devoid of any substance.  Reform is good, work with others, everyone gets a pony sort of thing.  He does use this to transition to global warming, and advocates a carbon cap and trade system.  While I don’t want to get into details here, I think a cap and trade is a particularly bad solution to this problem.  In any event, while global warming has some relevant to foreign policy, for the most part I think it is a seperate debate.

Lastly, Obama proposes an increase in foreign aid, to combat terrorist ideology.  I have two issues with this.  First, I don’t think we can very clearly point to foreign aid being an effective tool to combat poverty, and secondly I don’t think we can easily connect poverty to terrorism.  I am not opposed to foreign aid if it actually does good, and that alone is reason to do it in my opinion, whether terrorism is related to poverty or not.  Sadly though, I think or foreign aid has done more to prop up dictators and thereby increase poverty then it has done to alleviate it.

17 Comments »

Comment by honestpartisan

May 7, 2007 @ 9:05 am

Thank you for taking the time to read a lengthy piece I had recommended. The line in your last post that prompted me to recommend it reflected your skepticism that Democrats have some broad principles and policies when it comes to foreign policy in general and dealing with terror issues in particular. While Obama’s speech does have a lot of generalities, I recommended it specifically for that point: that he articulates the principles that would guide his foreign policy.

As for the specifics, the only thing I’ll deal with at this point is your position on foreign aid. Can foreign aid be wasteful or counterproductive? Of course. It’s not clear to me that indicts all foreign aid and, as Jeffrey Sachs points out in his book The End of Poverty, it’s certainly possible to have foreign aid that works.

The relationship between poverty and terrorism is a tricky one. Most of the leaders of Al Qaeda and other terror organizations come from affluent backgrounds. But a lot of the support they get comes from the poor. The Gaza Strip is an economic basket case, and underemployed young men (and sometimes women) from there willingly provide most of the cannon fodder for terror attacks (indeed, economic security is often assured for suicide bombers’ families, an incentive I would assume wouldn’t be necessary for richer people). Pakistani families finding it hard to feed their children are happy for the free room and board that Saudi-funded madrasses provide, which also incidentally indoctrinate the kids in extremist Muslim teachings. So while addressing poverty certainly won’t eliminate terrorism, it can be part of a broader anti-terror strategy.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 7, 2007 @ 10:30 am

I think my that the last lines in the post you were refering to was talking about actions, not rhetoric. The Democrats as a whole haven’t in my opinion shown a whole lot of principle in their actions, on foreign policy especially. Perhaps Obama would be different, and perhaps if he become President he can show that, but I think the general failure of his party in this area will be an impediment to that goal, although perhaps not an insurmountable one.

As the review you link to indicates, Sachs may have heavily oversold his case, and in any event what he is saying isn’t anything new. That has been said and tried for decades, with few success stories and those success stories are mostly due to internal changes within a country, not foreign aid. I don’t think any amount of money will raise the citizens of a corrupt nation ruled by kleptocrats out of poverty. Since a good portion of poor nations fit that decription, foriegn aid is not the sole solution. Without political reform, and institutions to protect individual rights, throwing money at the problem is useless.

As for terrorism and poverty, I am not sure how applicable the Gaza strip, and the occuppied territories are to the wider terrorism problem. Palestinian terror and Al-Qaeda terror are quite different things. I do think that terror is related to societal failures, and societal failures are related to poverty, but the cause is the societal failures themselves, which most foreign aid is simply not designed to deal with, rather then poverty causing terror.

Comment by honestpartisan

May 7, 2007 @ 12:44 pm

I’d take issue with your diagnosis of poor countries. A lot of the countries that have experienced rapid economic growth since World War Two have also been among the most corrupt: Indonesia, Thailand, and, of course, China. Despite the poor governance those countries have had (and which played some role in the Asian/Brazilian/Russian economic meltdown of 1997-1998), they’ve had good economic growth because of lots of investment and an orientation toward exports.

And then there are those among the poorest countries that have relatively good governments, like Mali or Niger, the latter of which recently gained the dubious distinction of being the first country with a democratically-elected government to experience famine.

Comment by Greg

May 9, 2007 @ 2:22 am

Dave and Honest Partisan: Obama is a closet Muslim. He was raised with a Muslim name. In all aspects of his so-called foreign policy(this man absolutely NEEDS to get a clue). Obama is also a closet anti-Semite. G-d help America if Obama is elected President which hopefully won’t happen. Obama doesn’t even see himself as “American”, not that he’d own up to it. This man is as anti-American as it gets.

Take the “b” out of Obama and replace it with an “s” and you get his true name.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 9, 2007 @ 6:25 am

Greg,

You are wrong, Obama is not a Muslim, he is a Christian and even if he was a Muslim that wouldn’t change my opinion of him. I also don’t think you have any evidence at all that he is an anti-Semite, and leveling that charge as you have, simply because of his name, is as bigoted as anything I have seen in some time.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 9, 2007 @ 6:39 am

HP,

I think you are reading ‘authoritarian’ or ‘anti-human rights’ when I say corruption. While often authoritarian regimes are corrupt, that is not always the case. Similarly, there are and have been democratically elected governments that are unable to control corruption effectively.

Comment by honestpartisan

May 9, 2007 @ 8:11 am

I think you are reading ‘authoritarian’ or ‘anti-human rights’ when I say corruption.

No, I’m not. I’m talking about the fact that you can’t get business done in China without paying someone off (I know it’s anecdotal, but in a prior job of mine, I worked with a lot of Chinese immigrants and they took it as a given that bribes are a natural course of business). The corrupt “crony capitalism” was pretty widely reported on in Thailand and Indonesia during the Asian economic crisis. Bangladesh, who’s GDP has been growing at a respectable 5-6% a year, has been rated as the most corrupt country in the world.

Corruption can have a negative impact on economic growth, but it’s not determinative, certainly not enough to condemn the entirety of foreign aid.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 9, 2007 @ 8:31 am

Using the economic success of Bangledash as a counter to my premise that economic improvement is virtually impossible with high corruption is hardly a resounding rebuttal in my opinion. Bangledash is an economic basket case.

I certainly don’t know the in and outs of Bangledashian economy, I don’t know if the corruption has been increasing or decreasing and of course your two sources are from two different time periods, which is problematic.

The Forbes article you quote of course agrees with the basic premise that corruption is a horrible drain on economic growth.

I am not saying that we shouldn’t help countries because they are corrupt, what I am saying is that unless part of the program is to address that corruption and other anti-personal property and anti-entreprenuerial impulses our charity will be ineffective. Just throwing money at poor countries won’t solve any of their problems.

(This doesn’t necessarily apply to natural disaster type situations, which have a somewhat different purpose, although sometimes ‘natural disasters’ are in fact political disasters in disguise)

Comment by Greg

May 9, 2007 @ 9:03 am

Dave: I wasn’t making an assumption when I said Obama was a closet Muslim, nor was I being racist or what have you when I claimed he was an anti-Semite. Yes, in fact, he is a closet Muslim and I have the sources to prove this and yes, indeed he is an anti-Semite and no, it’s not because of the way his name is spelled. I was just trying to be funny when I wrote about his name.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 9, 2007 @ 9:17 am

If you have such sources you should reveal them. I don’t believe you can prove either of those charges.

Comment by Greg

May 9, 2007 @ 10:15 am

My sources are a local doctor whom I trust and who alleges Obama was raised Muslim. Thus I said: “Obama is a closet Muslim” and not “Obama is Muslim.” Whether you believe me or not is not up to me to decide. As for the aformentioned pseudo-politician, he’s referred to Israel in a very negative light and as far as I’m concerned anti-Zionist=anti-Semite.

Comment by honestpartisan

May 9, 2007 @ 10:44 am

What’s evidence that Bangladesh is a basket case? Their economy has been growing at a pretty fast rate the past few years. Textile businesses that once relocated to China have relocated from China to Bangladesh (“The Travels of a T-Shirt in the Global Economy” by Pietra Rivoli discusses this phenonmenon). The report on Bangladesh being corrupt is from 2003, and the reports of the economic growth come after that; I don’t know why that time difference is significant. I doubt Bangladesh’s propensity for corruption changed that much in a couple of years.

“Just throwing money at poor countries won’t solve any of their problems” is a straw man — Jeffrey Sachs’ program is anything but “throwing money.” He also points out in his book how charges of corruption are often a convenient rationalization for skimping on foreign aid. I agree with you that it should be addressed.

Greg, its no secret that Obama lived in Indonesia as a child and went to a Muslim school. This was when he was about 8 or something. So what? And I challenge you to find anything he said that is anti-Zionist or anti-Semitic. He has been resolutely pro-Israel. Even Martin Peretz supports him.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 9, 2007 @ 12:08 pm

HP,

Bangledash is an very poor nation.

From the CIA factbook where you got the GDP growth numbers:

“Despite sustained domestic and international efforts to improve economic and demographic prospects, Bangladesh remains a poor, overpopulated, and inefficiently-governed nation. Although more than half of GDP is generated through the service sector, nearly two-thirds of Bangladeshis are employed in the agriculture sector, with rice as the single-most-important product. Major impediments to growth include frequent cyclones and floods, inefficient state-owned enterprises, inadequate port facilities, a rapidly growing labor force that cannot be absorbed by agriculture, delays in exploiting energy resources (natural gas), insufficient power supplies, and slow implementation of economic reforms. Reform is stalled in many instances by political infighting and corruption at all levels of government. Opposition from the bureaucracy, public sector unions, and other vested interest groups also have blocked progress. The BNP government, led by Prime Minister Khaleda ZIA, has the parliamentary strength to push through needed reforms, but the party’s political will to do so has been lacking in key areas. On an encouraging note, growth has been a steady 5-6% for the past several years.”

Sachs’ ‘program’ isn’t really anything new. It is the same program that has been tried, with little success, for a very long time. While he may claim charges of corruption are an excuse to do nothing, and that may at times be right, I think that often sending aid is a convenient rationalization for doing the hard work that it would take to actually help lift a nation out of poverty. A whole lot more then just ‘aid’ is needed for that to happen.

Comment by Greg

May 10, 2007 @ 12:40 am

HP: I’m not sure who Martin Perez is. Are you referring to Shimon Peres or Amir Peretz maybe? And your challenge stands. All the info. I have comes from first sources so that I doubt I could locate anything online.

Comment by Greg

May 15, 2007 @ 12:55 am

HP? Dave? Anybody home? You guys haven’t answered my question. And BTW: having done some research, I now take back my accusation of Obama being an anti-Semite. However, he is and always will be a closet-Muslim.

Comment by Greg

May 15, 2007 @ 12:55 am

Dave, check out my latest post if you get a chance. I think you’ll like it.

Comment by Dave Justus

May 15, 2007 @ 8:35 am

Greg,

I am not sure what question was asked that wasn’t answered.

As for Obama being a closet-Muslim, as far as I can tell you are asserting, all known evidence to the contrary, that in his heart Obama is a believer in Islam. While I can’t see into his heart, I don’t believe you can either.

And when you assert that he always will be, you are claiming to know the future as well. God may be able to see such things clearly, but I don’t believe that you can.

Obama claims to be Christian. He has been active in Christian organizations well before he was propelled to the national spotlight.

That doesn’t really matter to me though. Him being Muslim in and of itself is no better or worse then him being Christian or Atheist or Wiccan as far as I am concerned.

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